Harnessing the Power of 'Yes And' in Everyday Interactions with Kymberly Dakin-Neal

Ever found yourself stumbling through an elevator pitch or zoning out during an important conversation? Worry no more, because communication expert Kym Dakin-Neal joins us to share her transformative techniques, which will not only refine your communication style but also reignite your capacity to listen authentically. From her inspiring transition from Broadway to the boardroom, Kim demonstrates the power of improv to enrich our daily interactions. She even brings her creations to the table: a conflict resolution card game and the innovative bookmarking app, Nugget, both of which have reshaped the landscape of collaborative dialogue.

Prepare to rethink how you engage with others as we explore the 'Yes And' game, an insightful exercise that proves why every idea deserves its moment in the spotlight. The game tests our ability to constructively contribute to conversations, steering clear of the temptation to shut down creativity. We also dissect the Waldorf model of education, tailored for adults, and its surprising benefits in professional environments. This episode isn't just about talking; it's about breathing new life into the way we perceive and participate in the world around us.

Get a copy of Kym's book today at https://amzn.to/3wJ0oMB
Download Nugget at https://www.yournugget.com/

Buzzsprout - Let's get your podcast launched!
Start for FREE

Disclaimer: This post contains affiliate links. If you make a purchase, I may receive a commission at no extra cost to you.

Transcript

Speaker 2: 0:07

Welcome to the Communication 24-7 podcast, where we communicate about how we communicate. I'm your host, jennifer Furlong. Let me paint a picture for you. You are at a networking event, or you could even be at a party, or maybe you're just out in a restaurant and you see that one person from work who can make things happen and you know this is your one shot at having a very quick conversation with them, so you can introduce yourself and try to make an impact. The one problem is you have no idea what in the hell you want to say.

Speaker 2: 0:59

This is what we call the elevator pitch, the dreaded elevator pitch, and we have all been there. So this is one of many reasons why I have asked my guest to be here today, kim Deakin. She is going to help lead us through this very troublesome topic of the elevator pitch, but she also has some really great things that I want to talk to her about. As far as communication skills goes, she is a trainer, consultant, coach. She is an author. She has helped so many organizations improve their team building and how to bring people in and just be a part of the culture that exists within that organization. So we are going to talk also a little bit about improv and creativity and how we might apply those concepts in order to become more effective communicators. So, kim, I don't know if you can tell, but I'm super stoked that you're here.

Speaker 1: 1:58

I can tell that and I'm super stoked. Likewise, that's awesome. I love your podcast. I love the topic. People think communications is like this broad catch-all topic but, it's the source of so many other things, and that's why it's important and I'm just thrilled to be here.

Speaker 2: 2:23

We're going to have a lot of fun, Absolutely yeah, and thank you for saying that. One of my biggest pet peeves because it is just a huge umbrella term communication, and we could narrow down that focus in so many different ways. But the one thing I don't like is when I hear somebody call it a soft skill. I'm like there ain't nothing soft about this. This is the one skill your professional life, your personal life if you want to influence things that are happening in your community, this is probably the most important skill you need to learn to develop. So, yes, thank you. Thank you for that little, just recognition the importance of what it is that we're talking about today. So for our listeners, would you mind just telling us a little bit about yourself. What's your journey? How did you come to decide that you wanted to be a coach and a consultant in this area?

Speaker 1: 3:25

Yeah, well, I have been a trainer for quite some time, but I've also I spent quite a lot of time in the performing arts. I was actually on Broadway for a brief afternoon as an understudy. I was also in several off-Broadway shows, a couple of touring shows, so I got rid of my fear of being in front of people fairly early on. But as an introvert, I understand a lot of the mindset that we drag along when it comes to being our authentic selves in public. And you mentioned improvisation, improvisation. When you think about it, we're always improvising all the time, but whether we do it effectively or not is another question. And I find that when I coach people, when I bring in improvisation, oftentimes it's the notion of saying yes to whatever comes up, saying yes to a challenge, saying yes to a new idea, saying yes to the person who needs to have an in-depth conversation with you. And I guess if I had a guiding principle for my professional life, it would be that I almost always default to saying yes.

Speaker 1: 5:02

I'll tell this very brief story. The pandemic right, the shutdown we all went through it. We all have our stories about this time. But I noticed early on, even though all of my I had a really nice juicy year to look forward to, but it was all in person, so it all evaporated and I thought, well, the silver lining is time right.

Speaker 1: 5:30

For the first time in my adult professional life, I had days of unstructured time. So I decided to write a book through Seth Godin's Writing and Community program and I decided to take a class for women in developing online programs, in developing online products. Now, I am not a techie I truly am not. On no planet am I a techie. But I decided to embrace this because a couple of years prior, I had put together a card game to lead groups that were in conflict through conflict to collaboration, and I thought I got great feedback on it.

Speaker 1: 6:17

But part of it was I wonder if I could put this online. Well, it turns out I couldn't for a variety of reasons, the first one being you have. The most important element of creating an online product is addressing the right problem. So, long story short, the guy who created the class liked the problem I had come up with, which was how to increase engagement in online meetings. Right, everybody's distracted. Everybody's got their kids and their pets and their significant others in the background. We're all juggling 50 things. Somebody takes themselves off video and you know that they're either eating or they're scratching, or they're trying to close whatever it is they're doing.

Speaker 1: 7:13

So he liked that problem and he was after me to do the second rendition of the class, and I mean after me. He emailed me, he called me, he texted me. He said I like your problem and I want to work with you on it, and I have grant money to put behind it. Grant money, my attention, right. So we created together a bookmarking app called Nugget.

Speaker 1: 7:41

Nugget was sold last year for a nice hefty price. It essentially gives you the ability to take notes and online meetings without disconnecting yourself from the person in front of you and without having to sort through reams of video to tease out the essential elements. So with the push of a button, I can highlight the text on the transcript that says this is important Pay attention to this. Plus, I can send only those important elements to my team, should I choose to do so. It was very exciting helping create that. Yeah, I bet, and I didn't have much to do with the technology, but I became pretty damn good at pitching. So in these pitch contests, I'm in there with 20-somethings who are looking at me like who's this old girl? Well, I became the Nugget lady and I became the one to beat. So saying yes, I would say, is an improvisation concept that has served me pretty well, and it's one that I encourage other people to embrace as well with you know, with certain guidelines and parameters.

Speaker 1: 9:08

You can't say yes to everything.

Speaker 2: 9:10

It's impossible and we'll make you crazy, that's right, yeah, yeah, but we do have to have some boundaries, but I love the overall concept of that. Being able to say yes to things is empowering, and sometimes I think we are our own worst enemies in that we will talk ourselves out of things before we even give it a chance. I mean, at least if we try and you know what the entire station burned down when you were trying At least you can say you tried it. You had no idea if this new tool that you were creating was gonna take off or not, but you took that chance, you said yes to it and it worked out really well for you. I think that's a fantastic example of one of the reasons the things that can't happen when we allow ourselves to do that, and at a minimum right, like the Alana Smoreset song.

Speaker 1: 10:06

Right you learn yeah that's right.

Speaker 2: 10:09

Right, you learn, constantly learning, and that's one of the things about being a communication person. You know, if you are focusing on improving your communication skills, one of the things I think you learned very quickly is that every single day you can work on this skill and there's going to be something new to learn, there's gonna be something new to try out, and it may work. In some situations it may not work, you know, in some situations People are different. So one communication tool you use with one person and it seems to you know just how to make them tick the way you want them to tick. And then you try it on somebody else and it kind of like just falls flat right there. So that's what makes it interesting and exciting and frustrating all at the same time. Because if you're the type of person where just give me one thing that's gonna make it better, no, that's not how this works. That's not by any stretch of the imagination, I think.

Speaker 1: 11:11

I'm really glad you brought that up, jen, because in my blog post today I referenced I believe it was Atul Gawande who noted the difference between complicated problems and complex problems. Right, complicated problems may be difficult, but once you find the solution, you can replicate that solution and it will fix the problem next time it comes up. But with human beings and communication, those are complex problems. One size does not fit all. Those are case by case solutions.

Speaker 1: 11:54

That's why HR departments get in such trouble. They're always trying to create replicable solutions for complex problems. Yeah, it doesn't work. People get frustrated.

Speaker 2: 12:10

Absolutely. I mean, that's such a fantastic example. In the workplace, one person does something that kind of screws it up for everybody else and instead of addressing with that one individual, or instead of looking at okay, in this one instance, this is what happened. Now let's punish everybody or let's make up a new rule. Everybody has to use another guideline. Maybe that's not even necessary in the workplace, but you're making me think of your work with improv and creativity, talking about how humans are complex beings and communication. There is not some silver bullet out there that's gonna be able to just fix the problem for everybody across the board. I would imagine that having those improv skills really is. That's a tool that you can use that is really effective in different scenarios and with different people. So tell me a little bit about that that. How did you take me back to you when you first started developing your own improv skills and how did that? Over the years, how have you been able to hone those skills in a communication sense?

Speaker 1: 13:36

Really good question, jen. Thank you for that. And yeah, there's a lot of juice in that question. Yeah, oh good.

Speaker 1: 13:47

As an introvert, one of the reasons theater and scripts appeal to me is that the playwright gives you the words to say, right, yeah, yeah. And so weaning myself off of that dependency was truly not easy. I think I had a belief that I wouldn't be able to come up with the words I needed to say when I needed to say them, and I'd had multiple examples throughout my life of someone saying something to me and my reaction being one like dear in the headlights. It's like the world slows down, like what did you just tell me? Right, yeah? My brain has just gone completely blank. Yeah, yeah, the hiccup. So the hiccup, absolutely the hiccup. And so I think that sort of visceral experience made going into improvisation really trepidatious.

Speaker 1: 14:55

But the way that I got into it was through a fabulous improvisation form called Playback Theater. Playback Theater and you can look this up. It's all over the globe. It's been around since the 70s, but it's kind of a best kept secret. It doesn't tend to call attention to itself the way movies and Broadway does, because Playback is about real people telling true stories, and Playback is an improv form that will play those stories back in real time according to some improvisational structures. So it's structured improvisation. And I was part of that troupe for 15 years.

Speaker 1: 15:49

So what teased me into improvisation was the true story element. People's true stories of all was fascinated me, which is one of the impetuses behind my book. I wanted to tell the true stories of people who came to me with issues around communication and listening, discoveries that we found in my work with them. That built part of the model for this book Head, heart and Hand Listening. But for improvisation I had to build trust in myself slowly, and that's really what it is it's trust in yourself. So there's that, but there's also, I think, the other gift that improvisation gave me personally is the ability to step outside the boundaries of the realistic. The coach program that I undertook a few years ago was put together by Shiazad Shamin. It's called Positive Intelligence and he outlines nine different saboteurs that we all have in some combination, but also five sage powers that we can strengthen in order to mute the influence of our saboteurs. I know I'm getting into the weeds here, but no, no, I love this.

Speaker 2: 17:24

I'm like I'm paying so close attention. I'm just saying yeah, yeah, it's a comment.

Speaker 1: 17:32

Okay, but one of the five sage powers is Innovate and he employs a game. He's got a game going on for each of these five sage powers, but the one for Innovate is my favorite because it's based in improvisation. So if you come to me with, or you come to your group with, an issue that you would like some brainstorming on, if we played the yes and game A, we'd have a lot of fun. B, we would push the envelope of the group on what is considered realistic and possible, right. So if you came to be with a problem, is there an issue or a problem that comes up, a problem that comes up for you just off?

Speaker 1: 18:24

the top of your head.

Speaker 2: 18:25

For me personally, yeah, I often feel overwhelmed by all of the things that I'm doing and I love all of the things that I'm doing and sometimes I feel pressure to maybe give up some of the things, but I don't want to.

Speaker 1: 18:43

That's right. Sometimes I look at all the things that I'm doing and I consider them to be hungry children. Right, it's one thing to launch them, but then you have to raise them. Take care of them.

Speaker 1: 18:57

So, yeah, you've got a lot of hungry children. I hear you. I totally relate to that. So if we were to play the yes and game, there's a couple of rules. The language is very specific, right? So if you come to me with that problem and I think, and I say to you, well, one idea you could employ is to make a graphic drawing of each of these things that you want to do, pin it up on your wall and put the priorities visually in the top row. Okay, your language around.

Speaker 1: 19:40

Something like that would be oh, what I like about that idea is whatever you like about that idea. Then you would add to that idea, right? And then I would say to whatever you added oh, what I like about that idea is, and on we would go. Now, past a certain point, you start to realize these are very realistic solutions. These are very on budget solutions. Let's try to get a little bit out there and see what happens, right, because the nature of the game is you have got to find 10% of what that person just put into the circle. 10% validity, it's the 10% rule. What?

Speaker 2: 20:31

are the 10% rule. I'm not familiar with it.

Speaker 1: 20:37

The 10% rule says that every idea, no matter how wacky and weird, has at least 10% validity.

Speaker 2: 20:48

I love it.

Speaker 1: 20:50

Right. So instead of saying, oh, that will never work because we're already over budget, and blah blah, and we tried that last year. And blah, blah, right, and that person who offered that idea gets shot down and silenced.

Speaker 2: 21:03

And we'll probably keep their mouth shut from here on out for the rest of the time. Right.

Speaker 1: 21:08

Right, we've all been in those situations. And there are people what are they? They're called? They're not pot stirrers, but devil's advocate. Yeah, devil's advocate. Right, my job as devil's advocate is to shoot holes in your idea. Right, that's what I'm good at, right, I'm good at saying no. I'm not good at coming up with anything else. I've all encountered those people in meetings.

Speaker 2: 21:34

Yeah, absolutely.

Speaker 1: 21:37

So devil's advocate doesn't know what the hell to do when you play the yes and came yeah, because suddenly, oh, I have to not only find 10% of that weird wacky idea and articulate it, then I have to come up with something of my own.

Speaker 2: 21:53

Yeah, I have to build on that. I can't just tear it down. It's easy to tear something down.

Speaker 1: 21:59

Sure is, yeah. We see that happening in Congress all the time, don't Right? Yeah, and I will limit my political views to that statement, only Right.

Speaker 2: 22:13

You know, this is such a fantastic point that you're making with yes, and I think all too often, not only are we very eager to shoot our own ideas down and we don't even give them the space they need to grow, and to you know who cares how crazy that idea seems at the time, you know, but we're also very good at knocking down other people's ideas and we don't even realize we're doing it. Because the whole devil's advocate thing you know, I have been guilty of that, you know myself. When you're sitting there trying to think of, quote realistic solutions to the problems and then you get so hyper focused on finding the things that you can't do, it is really easy to just go down that black hole of negativity and, okay, well, we just spent, you know, two hours slamming our brains up against the brick wall here and, look, we have absolutely nothing to show for it. Now we haven't even moved forward. And then we want to know why. We're wondering why? Because there is no solution? It's hopeless? That's not the case at all. I love that. I just love the idea of that.

Speaker 2: 23:34

Yes, and If you are an organizational psychologist, an HR professional or just someone who wants to strengthen your listening skills. You should pick up a copy of Head, heart and Hands Listening today. This book explores the three listening modalities of Head, heart and Hands as active but largely unconscious lenses that inform the potency of our listening. It also includes a comprehensive listening assessment so you can improve listening in targeted ways. Get a copy of Head, Heart and Hands Listening by clicking on the link in the show notes.

Speaker 1: 24:16

Well, the how to's on the yes and are included in my book. So just so you know.

Speaker 2: 24:23

Absolutely. Yeah, that's going to be a useful tool, and I'm going to make sure that not only do I get a copy of it, but we're going to put that link in the show notes as well. Make sure that everybody else gets it, because that right there is worth it alone, and I'm sure there are all kinds of other golden nuggets that are hidden in there.

Speaker 1: 24:46

So just about every golden nugget I know. Yeah, well, because and this is why, when the book got accepted, I wrote, I think, six book proposals, with the help of a wonderful editor, heather Evans at Routledge, finally got the sixth one accepted and I had come up with about 26,000 words from my book and I thought I'd said everything I had to say. She said, oh, we've accepted it. And oh, by the way, your book now has to be three times as long. That's right, every golden nugget I ever encountered in my life is in this book.

Speaker 2: 25:27

You're like what? So that's when you're like yes, and that's right, Because talk about a big problem that you have to solve, like let me use this, I'm going to apply this concept right here, that's right.

Speaker 1: 25:49

I went to the book. I'll just talk for a little bit about it. It's built on a Waldorf model of early childhood education, which is head hearted, hands listening, and I brought it into the adult training realm. I've done numerous trainings on this and I started to get curious when I was working with the Department of Environmental Protection, with their field operators, who were going into having conversations with landowners that were trying to do something that was with their land, that was in violation of some environmental code. So you can imagine the tenor. These kinds yes, they were not openly friendly.

Speaker 2: 26:33

No, they were not friendly?

Speaker 1: 26:34

No, they were not. These field operators were science geeks, head listeners to the max because they've got data retention and in these conversations they were just looking for opportunities to bring more information into the conversation as a way to change a person's mind, and as a communication expert, I know you know how well that worked Like not at all.

Speaker 2: 27:05

In one ear and out the other.

Speaker 1: 27:06

That's right.

Speaker 1: 27:08

Blah blah, blah. They hired me as a communications person to come in and help them. But right away I understood it's not so much what they're saying is what they're listening for, and so I had to start getting them to listen, for opportunities to build alliance. What's the dream underneath? Filling in the wetlands Right? Is he trying to build a playground for his grandkids? Is he trying to build a parking lot? So he's for his used car business? You know, whatever it is, get underneath that dream, position yourself as an ally, and then that person will start listening to you.

Speaker 2: 27:50

Yeah, yeah, because whatever it is that they're wanting to do, I mean, it's valid.

Speaker 1: 27:56

That's right, that's exactly right and you've got to find that validity. But it started to get. I started to get curious about how our professions have us listening for certain information and downplaying other kinds. You know, we only have a certain amount of attention and bandwidth, but the stuff that we're bypassing in terms of our own retention and our own attention can come back to bite us in the butt, and often does, and that's exactly what was happening to those field operators. So that was the initial piece of work that sparked this book and sparked the journey for me.

Speaker 1: 28:42

Yeah, and I got curious about my own listening, you know, and as a communicator and a woman Okay, there, it is gender bias I assumed that I had heart listening in space. And then my daughter started going through a really rocky adolescence. She would, you know, she would come home, she didn't have a date for the prom, her face was breaking out. One of our friends was mean to her. Night after night, we're sitting on the deck holding her hand with a tissue box, blowing her nose. Teen angst, you want angst, adolescent angst in spades. And I discovered for myself that, you know, after a while I'm like okay, what are we going to do about it? Right?

Speaker 2: 29:34

How can we fix this? You're speaking my language.

Speaker 1: 29:37

It's like I've only got so much capacity right, like a broken record, and so that's where hands listening comes into play. I I begin with heart listening, but I go to hands listening pretty quickly, which is an Achilles heel of my own, because oftentimes, like with my daughter, you know she would go, mom, I just need you to listen, right.

Speaker 2: 30:10

Which parents I am. I've been listening all the time.

Speaker 1: 30:16

Right. Right, it's like definition of insanity, right. But hands listening is about finding solutions to problems. So I'm listening for things I could fix, things I could do something about. I'm listening for what could work in the future, going forward.

Speaker 1: 30:42

Heart listeners, with their reams of empathy, are very much in the present. They're engaged with what's happening one on one between you and me right now in our conversation. They can tune into facial expressions, vocal body language, what's happening underneath the content, very present. Head listeners are very engaged with what's already been proven in the past, what's been designated as facts. They're the people who can retain all kinds of information.

Speaker 1: 31:24

I myself am not a head listener, but I have had listeners in my life who I call upon right, who have been extremely valuable in my own professional process, and I know that there are ways I can amplify my own head listening, which I put in the head listening chapters in the book. But each of us has a couple of different modalities, most of us specialized maybe in one, maybe two. Right, it's a rare bird that's got all three. There's a fun assessment, both online at kimdakencom, where I tell you a true story that happened to me and you can tease out your own head listening modality, or it's also in the book a comprehensive assessment, but it's a lot of fun. So that's kind of it in that nutshell.

Speaker 2: 32:23

Yeah, yeah, I appreciate you bringing up the listening, because that is something that I think a lot of people struggle with. We find ourselves in trouble when we're not aware enough, or maybe mindful enough, that, as we're in that moment and we're having a conversation with someone, we can be using the wrong listening style, and that's the one thing, and I think you know I've never thought about it in these terms before, but having this conversation with you it's really bringing to mind for me that there are even a lot of improv skills that you're developing. As you're developing your listening skills and identifying when you need to switch between one listening style to the next, I know for me it's very, very challenging to use the heart listening, as you're describing it, and it go on and on and on, and then it goes away, but then it comes back and it's like the same thing again, you know, and? But I recognize that and I'll tell you a really quick, funny story. Listeners have probably already heard this before, but y'all just deal with it. So people who know me, you know I, they know that I it's challenging for me to have that type of empathy in the moment because I am so well, let's just get to the problem. I'm like you know, just stop with the emotions, focus on the problem. We don't have to worry about it anymore. I have one person.

Speaker 2: 34:12

She really surprised me. She was like Jen, you know, I just don't see that. And you, I think you are one of the most empathetic people I've ever met. I started laughing. I said I've got you so full. You know, what has happened is I have learned how to switch to the type of listening that needs to happen in that moment, so that I have everybody fold into thinking. I'm just like sitting there, giving you the space you need and hopefully that's just all. But if you come back to me two or three times, get ready, because I'm going to be like you're upset about this and I think you have ever right to be upset about this and it's time let's figure something out.

Speaker 1: 35:04

And listening right there, yeah.

Speaker 2: 35:09

I'm just making me think of that. You know talking about your daughter as well. You know my daughter's 25. So we went through the exact same thing that teen angst phase and man, it is difficult.

Speaker 1: 35:23

Oh, it's brutal. I know I was saying there's got to be a biological reason for all of this awfulness, right? Absolutely yeah. I bet your daughter, like my daughter, is one of the most resilient.

Speaker 2: 35:39

She's one of the most resilient women in the mid 20s women. Oh yeah, I'm so proud of her, you know, and I think it's just a testament to for for women in general, and you know, I think we all go through that phase at some point where we're just moody as hell and you know, the whole world is ending and I'm just being right and I, you know, I, I hate this and that and the other thing, and it's just you know, we got into the worst argument in the middle of a department store one time.

Speaker 2: 36:15

I remember she was 13 and we're shopping for clothes and she hated everything and I'm like, just just try it on, you don't have to buy. But how do you know if you don't like it, if you don't at least put it on? So, the long story short, we ended up leaving and not buying a damn thing, because, aren't you?

Speaker 1: 36:36

That's right.

Speaker 2: 36:37

There it is, yeah, yeah. So, moms, we get you, we, we believe you.

Speaker 1: 36:44

And then, when you're going through all of that angst and all those descriptions, it's like there's adolescents and then there's menopause.

Speaker 2: 36:52

Yeah, Fun, yeah, so we have all of these things working against us, which is why it's so good that we talk about these things. You know, like, like the tools, that that you and I have been talking about, you know it, some days it works and some days you know they don't work. It's okay, it's okay, it's. It's all a grand experiment in my mind.

Speaker 1: 37:21

Well, I know you want to get to the elevator pitch.

Speaker 2: 37:24

Yes, that so, thank you. Thank you for transitioning to that, because I would you know, this whole time I'll just keep talking and it'll be like wait a minute. We have 10 minutes. We still haven't gotten to the elevator pitch.

Speaker 1: 37:38

I do want to do want to. Before we transition completely, I do want to bring up active listening Right, describing how people describe you. Yeah, we've all kind of been steeped now in active listening, right. We're, we're mirroring our, our persons, our partners, facial expressions, body language, and we are asking questions and digging in deeper. But I feel like at this juncture, for many people who are in a hurry, yeah active listening has become acting like we're listening. Yes, until the other breath and you can barge in.

Speaker 2: 38:26

You're so right. I taught public speaking and human communication courses for 18 years and I used to tease my students because I we would talk about listening and I would tell them. Some of you, I can tell you have mastered the art of fake listening. You have been taught so much about how do you actively listen and you're so focused on those things, like everything you just described. You know the high contact, the head nods, the right. It's like if you're, if that's what you're thinking about, then you're not listening. It's if you're actually listening. You don't even have to think about that stuff. It's going to come across, you know, it's going to happen naturally. So that was just a fun memory you just made me think of with the students and they would laugh. They're like, yeah, you're right.

Speaker 1: 39:20

Busted, that's right?

Speaker 2: 39:23

Well, you know, you could just see it in their faces. You're like you want, want, want.

Speaker 2: 39:28

You've turned into Charlie Brown's teacher. You know want, want, want. And they're still looking at you, but they have that thousand yard stare. Yet they still managed to shake their head and nod in agreement. The right time. Yeah, so it's, yeah. So the lesson there? Folks do not try to fake listen or, you know, do the whole quote. I'm doing air quotes, active listening thing, mirroring and all of that. If that's what you're focused on, you're not going to make a connection. That's that way. Yeah, yeah Instead.

Speaker 1: 40:06

Instead, if you can activate your genuine, authentic curiosity, that goes a big distance. Even if somebody is talking about something droning on and on and on, if you can find one nugget to ask a question, a good question, that will take the droner off the surface of what they're saying, you have done both yourself and the person who's speaking, a big favor.

Speaker 2: 40:38

Yeah, go deep, go deep. I think introverts are especially good at that. I think so too. Quality yeah yeah, tooting our own horns, but yeah. So let's talk about the elevator pitch. You know it's such an important skill to be able to develop, and you know whether you are walking up to someone that you know you want to strike up a conversation with because you think they're the person that you need to network with. Or maybe you're in an interview and they ask you that question, that dreaded question. Tell me about yourself, you know. Oh, what the hell do I say to that?

Speaker 2: 41:25

So, yeah, let's talk about the elevator pitch, and what are some of the things that you think could help us become better at that?

Speaker 1: 41:38

Well, first of all, I think we should ditch the pitch and I think we can create a very short story that will tell the person asking more about who we are. Using three ingredients Okay, something about who you are, something authentic, you know. Example, I'm a working mom and a small business owner. We're appalling with how to make online meetings more engaging, yeah, okay. So that's a problem I'm working with, or something I'm curious about. Right, it's not the whole story, but there are some good ingredients in there, yeah.

Speaker 1: 42:23

Next, something about what you've done, so you have a chance to establish credibility, right. So, for example, when I was talking about Nugget, I got a team together to produce an online bookmarking app called Nugget, and even though I'm not a techie, it turns out I'm really good in the pitch contests. Yeah, and you can add an element of good news Right. Good news, so for a nice price. And better news right. This gained me three new entrepreneurs as presentation, training and pitch coaching clients. So something about what I want is the last ingredients. I love working with introverts and entrepreneurs on the cusp of greater visibility. If you know someone who could use my services, I'd love for you to get in touch with me.

Speaker 2: 43:27

Right, I really like that. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 1: 43:32

So that is all put together in one of my blog posts that I can send you the link directly to as a way to put that together. It's concise, you don't have to go off into too many rabbit holes. I like the addition personally about good news and better news. You stay positive, right, and the call to action right, the something you want, as long as you make that kind of open ended. Do you know anybody who could use?

Speaker 2: 44:05

my service.

Speaker 1: 44:06

If you do have them, get in touch with me.

Speaker 2: 44:09

Yeah, yeah. That is such a fantastic way to gain some insight into someone, just as you were describing your own story and that experience that you had and going into nugget and putting that team together and how you were describing that. It just makes me think of okay, here's someone who is resourceful, someone who can reach out to others, someone who is probably a good team player. Now here's someone who is a good problem solver, not afraid to do something new and different. I got all kinds of stuff out of that, just from you sharing that one teeny, tiny story and taking it through those steps that you went through. I really like that. I've heard a lot of tools that people will introduce to do that elevator pitch, and you're right. Even just the sound of the word pitch it just in some way comes off as disingenuousnet. It sure does.

Speaker 1: 45:23

Yeah, that's right, pitch makes us twitch. Yeah, like, oh, here we go, here we go. Yeah, I've got to jump into sales mode now, right.

Speaker 2: 45:35

And that's what it is. You hit the nail on the head right there. It's sales mode. And here comes the laundry list of all of the positive adjectives that I can come up with to try to describe myself without really getting too deep, without really getting you to see who I am as a person. That's right, yeah, yeah. So I really really appreciate you sharing that with us, when you think about it. Earlier I said whether there's somebody that you want to strike up a conversation with very quickly, or if you're already in the interview. They ask you that tell me about yourself question. What a fantastic way to answer that question.

Speaker 1: 46:23

That's right. You just need to keep a couple of ingredients in mind. Yeah, and you're telling them a story, right, right?

Speaker 2: 46:31

Yeah, and that's how we connect. That's right. So I feel like in our stories.

Speaker 2: 46:37

I feel like in just this time that you and I have had this conversation and sharing our different stories, I can already tell that if you and I were able to meet in real life and just have dinner and maybe a couple of glasses of wine, I mean it would have been pulling up all nighter. I just feel like I know you so well just from listening to you share your stories and I am able to feel that connection with you now because of that. And wow, so what a powerful way to exemplify the things that you're talking about in your book and I'm sure what you talk about when you go into different organizations and work with different teams.

Speaker 1: 47:25

Yeah, yeah, that's fantastic. I love to pull together a workshop for women on this elevator pitch. Yeah, we could have a lot of fun.

Speaker 2: 47:37

Yeah.

Speaker 1: 47:38

So you have sparked something. You sparked a new idea for me.

Speaker 2: 47:42

I know this is the great thing about having these conversations, right.

Speaker 1: 47:46

Right, jen, this has been delightful. Thank you so much.

Speaker 2: 47:51

Yeah, yeah, all right, you know let's go ahead and wrap it up, because we're already coming up on 50 minutes here. So time flies when you have time, but I don't want to end the conversation without giving you the opportunity. Is there something that you feel is important that our listeners hear from you before we wrap things up?

Speaker 1: 48:16

I would just encourage them to come and check out my website, kymdakincom, and have a sample coaching session with me. We could have a lot of fun. I use the positive intelligence model, but I also use a lot of improv and a lot of the things that we talked about today, so I'm just inviting people to show up. Try it, you might like it.

Speaker 2: 48:47

Yeah, I bet they will, and you have inspired me to look up some improv classes that might be happening around me. Beautiful, it was called Playbook, a Playback.

Speaker 1: 48:59

Playback. Yes, and there are most likely a company in town near you.

Speaker 2: 49:05

Yeah, I'm going to look it up. I'm going to go have some fun with that because I think we can do that. Yeah, we all need a little fun, we sure do we?

Speaker 1: 49:13

sure, do All right, kim.

Speaker 2: 49:16

It has been such a pleasure having you on the show, having this conversation with you. I feel inspired, I feel hopeful, I feel motivated, and I know the listeners feel the exact same way and I do hope that you'll consider coming back at some point maybe, you know, after the new year. We'll just touch base again, and there are lots of things that we can continue this conversation about. Yes, indeed, thank you so much Jen. Absolutely All right.

Speaker 1: 49:48

More plug for the book. Yeah, you go to the Routledge website R-O-U-T-L-E-D-G-E and look up Head, heart and Hands Listening. You can get a discount on the book price through the end of the month. Okay, august 3rd first.

Speaker 2: 50:07

Okay, Well, thank you for sharing that. All right, Listeners, I know you enjoyed this as much as I did. I really hope that you take the things that we talked about to heart, apply them, practice them and practice them some more, because that's what communication skills are all about. It's just, you know the grand experiment. Just keep working at it. All right, I hope you all have a wonderful rest of your day and we'll see you next time.

Speaker 1: 50:37

Thanks so much. Jen Take care you too.

Speaker 2: 50:48

Thanks for listening. If you enjoyed this episode and you'd like to help support the podcast, please share it with others, Think about it on social media or leave a rating and a review.